tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post6481568366497794693..comments2024-03-20T18:38:31.327-05:00Comments on Havolim: Yalkut Shimoni at the End of Iyov and SukkosEliezer Eisenberghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16036989084122930226noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-53545386840484667532009-10-09T17:37:20.530-05:002009-10-09T17:37:20.530-05:00http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/epiphenomen...http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/epiphenomena<br /><br />I meant it in the sense of the medical dictionary-- a coincidental event that appears significant but is actually totally irrelevant. Epi-external; phenomenon-phenomenon.<br /><br />Could it be that Wiki is not thorough enough????<br /><br />And Ariella, unfortunately, parents are responsible for their kids, certainly until majority, and even afterwords, if, as is often the case, they raised them badly. Re'u gidulim shegidaltem, and Miriam bas Bilga.<br /><br />Good Yomtov!Eliezer Eisenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16036989084122930226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-85036166408662930982009-10-09T16:25:25.269-05:002009-10-09T16:25:25.269-05:00http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/epiphenomenonhttp://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/epiphenomenonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-30700355149948531432009-10-09T15:04:19.337-05:002009-10-09T15:04:19.337-05:00Nice, and the very first time I've read the wo...Nice, and the very first time I've read the word "epiphenomena." :-)<br /><br />But, R' Chaim, how could the parent be held responsible for his children's actions in a literal sense when the principle is that avos do not die al banim? In a philosophical sense there is some connection, for IIRC correctly Yitzchak declines to lead the toast (taken up by David in the end) because he had a son Esav.Ariella's bloghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09409352047101582583noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-52472808378889681392009-10-08T13:51:54.804-05:002009-10-08T13:51:54.804-05:00Thank you Rabbi Shandalov; Chag Samei'ach, and...Thank you Rabbi Shandalov; Chag Samei'ach, and we're all vicariously enjoying the fulfillment of your dream of Aliyah. Alevai we will all follow you! And...regards and love to the great Barry F! Remind him that his last name is gematria Amalek! (and the Aleph doesn't count!)Eliezer Eisenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16036989084122930226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-70740320812133061782009-10-08T13:24:06.424-05:002009-10-08T13:24:06.424-05:00There are very few things on the internet that mak...There are very few things on the internet that make one say, "THIS is worth the entire internet." However, your blog is one exception! I am constantly amazed at the erudition and chochma displayed in your writing. On behalf of readers of your blog, I thank you for sharing even a small portion of your Torah with the rest of us. Tizke L'mitzvot!Zev M Shandalovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14159846523541240241noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-3878406850716268132009-10-08T12:42:36.917-05:002009-10-08T12:42:36.917-05:00Thank you, Eli. I incorporated your explanation a...Thank you, Eli. I incorporated your explanation and corrections.Eliezer Eisenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16036989084122930226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-61597482122371302462009-10-08T09:11:56.983-05:002009-10-08T09:11:56.983-05:00Thank you for this Yalkut, I might use it today.
...Thank you for this Yalkut, I might use it today. <br />Maybe a possible Pshat is the following: <br /><br />Sukka is known to represent Hashem's protection and Hashgacha (e.g. Erchin 32b ואגין זכותא עלייהו כי סוכה, and the interchange of Shomer Amo Yisrael Laad <-> Hapores Sukkat Shalom). <br /><br />Sukka tells us that it is just so that one could be in a place where the 4th wall is missing, the 3rd is only tephach, and the other two are some combination of God, Lavud & Dophen Akumma. Yet, it is a kosher Sukka. <br /><br />We often look around and see holes in this protection shield. Iyyov feels he was left out there, no Mechitzos, no protection around. But, when he would see the full picture, the full Sukka, it should become clear that what looked like nothing around was in fact part of the bigger Sukkat Livyatan. Would he then dare to "fix" it?<br /><br />PS I think the quote from Yalkut is missing its end. וא״ת עורו של לויתן אינו דבר משובח is not left unanswered there, but it continues א"ר פנחס הכהן בר חייא ור' ירמיה בש"ר שמואל בר רב יצחק פספסי הרוחות שלו מכהות גלגל חמה שנאמר האומר לחרס ולא יזרח. ירפד חרוץ עלי טיט, אין לך מזוהם של דג אלא מקום רפידתו, ומקום רפידתו של לויתן יפה של זהב לכך נאמר ירפד חרוץ עלי טיט<br />accordingly I'm not sure about the translation "do you think that is appropriate?"Elihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12793717193734899866noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-9262409480222824102009-10-07T20:45:09.802-05:002009-10-07T20:45:09.802-05:00It's an acquired taste. You can start off eas...It's an acquired taste. You can start off easy with the Chasam Sofer or Ksav Sofer, graduate to the Yismach Moshe, and then the Divrei Yoel is the post graduate level.<br /><br />After hearing enough brisker chakiros I think you can pretty much get the hang of the derech and formulate similar conceptual constructs. I don't get the same sense reading Yismach Moshe type seforim. It seems to be pure genius ato find connections between the most unrelated topics. But then again, maybe if this stuff was the bread and butter of my learning I would have a better handle on it.Chaim B.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02231811394447584320noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-15184489978119377812009-10-07T20:13:23.367-05:002009-10-07T20:13:23.367-05:00Once again, Chaim B to the rescue.
You probably c...Once again, Chaim B to the rescue.<br /><br />You probably can guess my reaction to the Yismach Moshe. BUT, and I really believe this, the Yismach Moshe didn't create himself. There has always been a faction of Klal Yisrael that used this sort of approach to Torah. It is possible, I suppose, that his great...grandfather wrote this Medrash and meant it to be understood as he taitches it.Eliezer Eisenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16036989084122930226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-83952663906646234012009-10-07T19:42:07.213-05:002009-10-07T19:42:07.213-05:00The Yismach Moshe end of Parshas Emor explains the...The Yismach Moshe end of Parshas Emor explains the connection specifically to Iyov. There is a Midrash Pliya which says that Iyov had no consolation until he saw the pesukim of "basukos, basukos, basukos", i.e. sounds like a remez to the derasha that teaches us 3 walls are OK based on the fact that sukos is written chaseir. What does that mean?<br />Hagahos Ashr"i on B"K 17 writes a yesod that a halacha l'moshe m'sinai always comes to subtract from the din d'oraysa -- chatzi nezek tzeroros is k'gufo but the hlmm"s teaches that you pay half, not the other way around (i.e. not that its lav k'gufo and you should be patur but the hlmm"s is mechayeiv you). How do we know this? From sukkah, where the hlmm"s tells us it's OK to subtract walls.<br />The pilpul punchline goes like this: Iyov's kids were bad, but he held that he was not responsible for them because they are kocho, not gufo. Hashem responded with sukkah and this cheshbon of the Ashr"I that we learn from sukkah that kocho k'gufo.<br />He goes a little deeper and explains that torah sheb'a"p = rachamim; torah b'ksav=din. Hashem gives us schar as if we had 4 walls (which din requires) based on the midas harachamim that accepts 3. Hashem's response was that despite his complains Iyov was being treated with rachamanus but deserved more punishment for his children/kocho.<br /><br />It's hard to summarize this type pilpul and I probably mangled it. Hopefully you have the sefer or know a Satmar chassid that can lend you one to have a look. It's a good Hagahos Ashr"i to know even if you don't like the pilpul that goes with it ; )Chaim B.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02231811394447584320noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-65006020310697788692009-10-06T10:19:05.260-05:002009-10-06T10:19:05.260-05:00See R' Tzadok in Pri Tzadik, Sukkos, #11.See R' Tzadok in Pri Tzadik, Sukkos, #11.Chaim B.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02231811394447584320noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-73259337952425590022009-10-05T23:41:51.663-05:002009-10-05T23:41:51.663-05:00Translation?Translation?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com