tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post7242429863235072544..comments2024-03-20T18:38:31.327-05:00Comments on Havolim: Va'eschanan, Devarim 6:13. Honoring Hashem and Talmidei ChachamimEliezer Eisenberghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16036989084122930226noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-88805162021445624272011-08-14T11:24:13.275-05:002011-08-14T11:24:13.275-05:00Daniel-
1. Oooops. I've been thinking about...Daniel-<br /><br />1. Oooops. I've been thinking about too many of the machloksin Reb Akiva and Reb Yishmael, like Nechira bamidbar and many others. I'm going to fix it now.<br /><br />2. A career is a good thing. אם תבקשינה ככסף.....<br /><br />3. The third one is Hashem, not Elokim, which I see you address in your next comment. <br /><br />As for the next comment about normal structure, maybe you're right, but the difference would have to be developed more.Eliezer Eisenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16036989084122930226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-11685051494531169192011-08-13T13:37:09.765-05:002011-08-13T13:37:09.765-05:00For what it's worth, re: the great question fr...For what it's worth, re: the great question from the pasuk למען תירא את ה אלקיך... my feeling is that the particular difficulty Shimon HaAmsuni has with את ה אלקיך תירא and not the למען תירא is because (as the Malbim holds as a rule in his peirush to VaYikra) the normal syntax is Subject, Verb, Object and yet with את ה אלהיך תירא the Subject and Verb (תירא) is AFTER the object of את ה' אלהיך.<br /><br />I've seen this distinction as a reason for a derasha elsewhere in the Zohar as well but unfortunately could not tell you the place.Danielhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04703845596227974473noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-32281831185412776022011-08-13T13:18:02.712-05:002011-08-13T13:18:02.712-05:001- I'm familiar with Shimon HaAmsuni darshenin...1- I'm familiar with Shimon HaAmsuni darshening את.. where did R' Yishmael come from?<br /><br />2- I know you didn't mean it negatively, but it's a little ironic how after having just finished discussing the parameters of את ה אלקיך תירא and it's including talmidei chachaim, you then blithely write "Shimon the Amsoni made a CAREER of interpreting the word "Es"". Do you think he would have appreciated that line?<br /><br />3- I'm not offering a solution to all the good points and pesukim you raised. However, just to add more color on one point, the two pesukim you bring of מן קדם use the word אלהים, which is different than הויה.<br />את האלהים אני ירא and ותיראן המילדות את האלהים.<br /><br />I point this out because the word את is often a reference to the female שכינה aka מלכות (i can offer some proofs/remazim if you'd like). Since אלהים though is also a female component, how to interpret an את alongside it will be different than an את alongside a male הויה. Furthermore, an את alongside a הויה אלהיך will need also to be interpreted differently.Danielhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04703845596227974473noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-84187862714557118512011-08-12T12:30:30.795-05:002011-08-12T12:30:30.795-05:00I heard exactly what you suggested from Rav Gifter...I heard exactly what you suggested from Rav Gifter. Reb Yishmael's willingness to abandon a lifetime of drashos out of bikush ha'emes and humility inspired Reb Akiva to say that true talmidei chachamim are G-d's voice in this world, and as such, comprise His revelation and must be honored as His emissaries.bnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8955681.post-84546531568417618922011-08-12T11:53:43.348-05:002011-08-12T11:53:43.348-05:00I think R' Yishmael's underlying complaint...I think R' Yishmael's underlying complaint had nothing to do with this derashah. R' Yishmael is the one who said "diberah Torah belashon benei Adam" and thus had no place for darshening an "es". This is the battle between R' Aqiva darshening even the tagin on the letters and R' Yishmael telling you that derashos have to do with meaning, not syntax. RY had no reason to force-fit a resolution since he didn't agree with the underlying assumptions of the whole project!<br /><br />And for that matter, I think R' Aqiva was as much talking about the derashah the awe (yir'ah) he had for someone intellectually honest enough to be willing to throw away a life's work, the explanations given to the thousands of "es"s he had for the first four books and the beginning of Devarim, if he could find one case that was impossible. Perhaps it was experiencing this level of intellectual honesty that suggested to RA his resolution!<br /><br />-michamicha bergerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11612144735431285113noreply@blogger.com